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Weyburn Murder

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Sofaking View Post

    Yea I get that. None of these kids were bad though. The whole thing is just stupid, nobody needed to get shot over this.
    Just Disney Prince’s right....

    The same can be said for most people in jail for murder, rape , etc. Most of them have substance abuse issues or mental health issues. Very few are psychopaths.
    Last edited by Cflgridiron; 01-06-2019, 08:14 PM.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Cflgridiron View Post

      Just Disney Prince’s right....

      The same can be said for most people in jail for murder, rape , etc. Most of them have substance abuse issues or mental health issues. Very few are psychopaths.
      So where did these kids take a left turn? And what can we do to prevent that.

      I ask my kid wtf! and he doesn't seem even surprised, he grew up with these kids.
      Last edited by Sofaking; 01-06-2019, 08:19 PM.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Sofaking View Post

        I understand that. My point was trying to be that I know all these kids, some of them not well but I know who they are. How did they get from kids I used to watch knocking a soccer ball around to a drug dealing gun toting incident in just a few years?
        They are the same kids. Soccer wasn't the sum total of their makeup and neither is this incident. Life is complicated. Hopefully its a teachable moment for your boys

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        • #19
          Originally posted by tommy_boy View Post

          Until they do it again and again and again and you as a parent can no longer bankroll your kids drug addiction.
          This^^^^

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Sofaking View Post

            So where did these kids take a left turn? And what can we do to prevent that.

            I ask my kid wtf! and he doesn't seem even surprised, he grew up with these kids.
            Probably with drinking/drugs. In my very brief temporary career as a provincial jail guard, I spent the long slow nights studying case files of the inmates with the same question in mind. Every single one, not 99% of them, 100% of them, started out with alcohol and/or drugs. Either a DUI, or possession, or something small to start with. Then progressively worse crimes in order to get money for the drugs and booze, or assaults related to being drunk or high. Every single one of them.

            What to prevent it in youth? Don't glorify drinking and drug use is the easy answer, but its not easily accomplished. Kids learn from an early age that booze creates their fun, as they see their parents do it as well. SOme can handle it, and some get immediately hooked and need to chase bigger and bigger highs, getting more and more desperate.
            Last edited by squish; 01-06-2019, 08:25 PM.

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            • #21
              It really does make you wonder. Makes me recall the Ternowetsky and Kummerfield incident of 20 years ago. Both those guys grew up in upper middle class homes and had every opportunity to excel in life. But they got drunk and beat a woman to death with a tire iron. My son played hockey with Ternowetsky when they were about 14, his dad was a social work prof at the U of R, they seemed like your normal family next door.

              **** happens I guess, especially when booze and drugs are involved.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by squish View Post

                Probably with drinking/drugs. In my very brief temporary career as a provincial jail guard, I spent the long slow nights studying case files of the inmates with the same question in mind. Every single one, not 99% of them, 100% of them, started out with alcohol and/or drugs. Either a DUI, or possession, or something small to start with. Then progressively worse crimes in order to get money for the drugs and booze, or assaults related to being drunk or high. Every single one of them.

                What to prevent it in youth? Don't glorify drinking and drug use is the easy answer, but its not easily accomplished. Kids learn from an early age that booze creates their fun, as they see their parents do it as well. SOme can handle it, and some get immediately hooked and need to chase bigger and bigger highs, getting more and more desperate.
                You are right and I know that, it starts with drinking and now getting into drugs is a whole lot easier than I was a kid. It starts with pot and I don't even wan't to go there because I am 100% making it legal. But then it turns into amphetamines, then coke, then god knows what. I know some of these kids parents and they are not bad people and not bad parents. How do you go from a kid kicking a ball around to one that is ready to shoot someone over a drug deal? I'm just having trouble wrapping my head around that.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Sofaking View Post

                  You are right and I know that, it starts with drinking and now getting into drugs is a whole lot easier than I was a kid. It starts with pot and I don't even wan't to go there because I am 100% making it legal. But then it turns into amphetamines, then coke, then god knows what. I know some of these kids parents and they are not bad people and not bad parents. How do you go from a kid kicking a ball around to one that is ready to shoot someone over a drug deal? I'm just having trouble wrapping my head around that.
                  Guessing, but probably some combination of boredom/hopelessnes of being in a small town, the lure of getting drunk/high with friends because that makes everything seem more fun, and combine that with perhaps a hereditary addictive gene, and there you have it.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by squish View Post

                    Guessing, but probably some combination of boredom/hopelessnes of being in a small town, the lure of getting drunk/high with friends because that makes everything seem more fun, and combine that with perhaps a hereditary addictive gene, and there you have it.
                    Availabilty as well. When I was a youngster in high school we could always find someone to "pull" for us. If someone tried real hard we could find weed. But never any thought about cocaine or anything else. Now it seems like you can just look at buddies locker down the hall and he's going to have anything you want. Times have changed. Like I said my son (18) knows these kids and this whole incident hasns't surprised or shocked him in the least.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Sofaking View Post

                      Availabilty as well. When I was a youngster in high school we could always find someone to "pull" for us. If someone tried real hard we could find weed. But never any thought about cocaine or anything else. Now it seems like you can just look at buddies locker down the hall and he's going to have anything you want. Times have changed. Like I said my son (18) knows these kids and this whole incident hasns't surprised or shocked him in the least.
                      So were they all still in grade 12?

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by squish View Post

                        So were they all still in grade 12?
                        There was a 23 year old and a 25 year old involved so I'm thinking probably not unless they are taking a few extra years to get it done.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by mrguy View Post

                          There was a 23 year old and a 25 year old involved so I'm thinking probably not unless they are taking a few extra years to get it done.
                          No they were all older than my boys, one of them actually babysat for my kids. When I said they grew up together it was a bit of a stretch, I knew their parents, I knew their kids but they were a few years apart from mine.
                          Last edited by Sofaking; 01-07-2019, 03:03 AM.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Sofaking View Post

                            So where did these kids take a left turn? And what can we do to prevent that.

                            I ask my kid wtf! and he doesn't seem even surprised, he grew up with these kids.
                            The very first step I believe is to integrate child and youth into the school system. Mental health should be a integrated part of the educational system not separate. Kids that struggle to integrate need to be moved into special classes where they can learn and be more successful. Right now it is a fight and can take years for a high functioning autistic child to get into the supportive classroom. Kids that go into the program early often are able to mainstream after a few years. Those that are delayed into the program it takes longer and mainstreaming may not happen. These programs and classrooms are amazing but kids with other disorders do not have similar opportunities. They need special classrooms dedicated to deal with other extreme cases of behaviour disorderes separate from the classrooms for autistic students. The larger schools should have dedicated social workers and psychologists. The smaller schools would have shared social workers and psychologists.

                            That is where I would start. I have seen the success of these small classrooms. Without them many of these kids would not receive an education at all.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Cflgridiron View Post

                              The very first step I believe is to integrate child and youth into the school system. Mental health should be a integrated part of the educational system not separate. Kids that struggle to integrate need to be moved into special classes where they can learn and be more successful. Right now it is a fight and can take years for a high functioning autistic child to get into the supportive classroom. Kids that go into the program early often are able to mainstream after a few years. Those that are delayed into the program it takes longer and mainstreaming may not happen. These programs and classrooms are amazing but kids with other disorders do not have similar opportunities. They need special classrooms dedicated to deal with other extreme cases of behaviour disorderes separate from the classrooms for autistic students. The larger schools should have dedicated social workers and psychologists. The smaller schools would have shared social workers and psychologists.

                              That is where I would start. I have seen the success of these small classrooms. Without them many of these kids would not receive an education at all.
                              That is an incredible idea. Won't ever happen here because it costs a lot. Saves money long term but Governments don't think beyond the 4 year election cycle.

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by rickyg View Post

                                That is an incredible idea. Won't ever happen here because it costs a lot. Saves money long term but Governments don't think beyond the 4 year election cycle.
                                Quite true. How do you quantify a success, as good as it might be for society and all concerned?

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